urgent armour advice please!

[TD-4935]

I have a quandrey requiring expert advice.

My friend recently purchased some AP armour that i am helping to put together. when she came round with the box and we started to lay the pieces out i noticed it had a blue/greyish hue to it, not milky white like my AP kit. it also felt thinner and more brittle.

now i'm only going with what i know and after putting together and/or modding three kits that i knew for sure were ABS, and i'm talking about the way it behaves when cutting and the smell it gives off here (this particular kit's smell when cut is pretty acrid kinda acidic and chemically, not very nice. oddly i find the smell of ABS quite nice in contrast to this stuff) i'm pretty sure this isn't ABS.

What i would like to know is, how can one tell if it's ABS or as i suspect styrene?

what is the difference between styrene and ABS?

I know TE/TE2 is styrene but why is this used over ABS?

should my friend ask for a refund as she doesn't want to have to spray it white and was told it was ABS?

i just need some tech ammo on this before i go causing trouble so your help is very much appreciated.

*edit* i know A.B.S. contains styrene hence the "S". just trying to clear up what this is so here are some comparison photos.

without flash

flash

A.B.S SDS, ?AP, A.B.S. AP

i'm not going mad am i? the one in the middle does not look like ABS does it. oh dear, i think i've been awake too long.

[bearden6521]

I'll be watching this post! I just purchased AP about a month ago but I don't have anything to compare it to. I did notice when sanding the edges it does give off a stinky chemical smell. I just hope AP didn't slip me a PVC kit but charge me full price for the ABS one!!!

[TD-4510]

I bet its the new PVC armor for $450.00. thin, say .020 ???

I got my AP about 5 months ago and its ABS. Pain in the **** to put together though. My RT MOD was very thick and all pretrimmed, ahhhhhhhh pretrimmed... The price we pay for accuracy.

I do have to say that that AP looks like a nice TIGHT pull!

[TD-4935]

My friend was told it was ABS. this reflects in the price she paid. i'm not sure of anything and i don't want to start a AP slur or anything. i just really wanna know whether it is ABS or not so i can adapt my work/process with this material.

[The Dirty Trooper]

MMmm.

[Rolf]

In 2001 i got my GT armor.

Sold it in 2004 to get my two GF armor.

Sold them in 2005 to get my two AP armor (its was at that time TK409 was in on it as well, AP and 409 was saying the will be the best armor ever, 80 thick milky white glossy abs whit better vacum shop job in a tolal clean AP mold for better sharpness) and it was.

Here is my point.

In early 2006 i buy two new AP armors, because i like the string longer modify on the belly box (more accurate this time).

But they was not as thick as my last two AP ones, and the colour was like yours Simon more blue in a way.

I think it was ABS, just a bit thinner and a different whiteness to it.

I dont think AP wonna play us around, i just think that the first runs of AP´s was the best job to get up.

And i know from AP him self (i spoke to him about it), that the old ABS milky white glossy first run of AP he can get eny more.

Because the shop where he was getting it from dont have that ABS eny more.

So i sold the new AP 06 again, and i now only have my two AP´s from 05 first run.

One thing, i never made eny money out of this.

I sold them to friends for the same price, ready to wear.

Hope it might help.

All the best from here.

Rolf

[tk-d]

dam i feel like someone p**sed on my chips i've just noticed it as well on the kit i've had so now i'm not happy. I even brought a helmet made by AP which also has that blue haze on it. My only problem now is i've started to cut some of it and had a few errors which will be hidden when i assemble it but he'll probably turn down a refund for it. I feel cheated as I'm gonna stand out against other troopers and i was talked out of a TE2 kit which would have been trimed and just needed painting.We need someone to come on to explain this and why we weren't made aware of it from the start. As I'm new to all this I feel kinda that I've Been Taken advantage of and slightly soured the experience

[TD-4510]

Guys. For the most part ABS is a blueish white up against a painted set. Thats not so unusual. Hey, as long as its not fragile and can be painted who cares? Use the Krylon fusion, it works great!

Its just a different shade of plastic.

The only milky white armor I have ever seen was my RT-MOD from Canada. He used .093 thick ABS that was clearly different in color from the FX kits which use the blueish ABS from the US. I bet if I still had my RT, that my AP would be a blue'r shade too.

No biggy. I can tell you this much, that pull on the AP faceplate looks really nice and tight. Send it here, I will take it. HEE HEE!!!

Now if its too thin, I would definetely call him on it. My AP set isnt too thin. I would say its .060-.080 thickness. Some parts are thinner than others too. The higher the mold sets off the vac table, the thinner the pull. So Helmets and chest and back will be a little thinner. Also smaller parts, he uses thinner plastic, like hand guards and ears. On my AP the thinnest part was the face plate. It was very fragile. I ended up ruining it.

When I asked AP to sell me another, he kept putting me off, saying that he would get back to me on the next run. I ended up buying a TE instead, and I am happy with it. That was an expensive mistake.

[TD 8733]

. I definitely feel bad for you guys that are having problems. Hopefully you can get it worked out. I will say that myself and TD 1009 purchased AP armor in 2006. I love mine and had no problems and I think Luke will say the same. This is the first time I have heard any complaints like this about AP.

[tk-d]

I have a knee plate and it's milky white as compared to my blueish armour and thats ABS I'm happy with the look but wished he'd informed us. Oh and it is thinner than the knee plate as well. If he come's on this board at all, Would be nice to have some input off him. It's still a good looking set but the colour is just a downer.

Anyone in the UK know what colour paint (prefer. Spray can) I can use to get it the right colour

[troopermaster]

It could be simply that he has a different supplier for his plastic.I know that I can buy my HIPS from the same supplier and get slightly different shades of white.Unless it comes from the same batch,then it's likely not going to be exactly the same shade.As for the thickness then it does sound as though he is using a thinner guage.I use .100 for everything except the belly detailing and they are usually a very slightly different shade of white but nothing too noticable.The problem with using different guages is the same as buying different batches.It's not a problem if you are going to paint it but if your not....

I don't know for sure about styrene,but HIPS melts when you trim it with a sanding wheel and I've been told ABS turns to powder so maybe you can tell what it is that way?

I would not fret too much about the colour,as long as it's consistant througout the suit.Though,if it's not ABS then something needs to be done about it.

-Paul.

[TD-4935]

I'm not annoyed and i certainly didn't want to worry people i just like to know what i'm working with. my AP kit is milky white ABS of this i'm sure. my SDS is capped ABS of this i'm certain. both these kits behaved the same and gave off the same smell when dremeled. they are both pretty much the same tone of white and very glossy. the AP kit in question is as you can see very much a different white, almost grey. the photo's don't show just how much of a contrast they all are. also my AP had no evidence of the helmet bubble that alot of AP kits seem to plagued by these days. all in all i was just worried about the need to spray as i am no expert and as i'm doing it for someone else the pressure is on to make it look good

i have no problems with AP at all, am very happy with my kit and yes the pull on the lid is very nice. i'm just curious is all

Everyone cool?

[TD-4935]

just to assure everyone, Mr AP has emailed my friend and said that it is ABS just a different hue. the gauge is as stated just thinner in difficult forming areas. i just got worried because of the smell. maybe it has a higher styrene content or something, i don't know. needless to say you can all relax.

I will have to spray though so this leads me to my next question.

would it be better to assemble then spray? my only concern about spraying then assembling would be the glue sticking to paint not plastic resulting in the phenomenon i like to call "the no more nails issue"

anyone thats ever tried to attach a shelf to the wall with no more nails will realise that yes it does stick very well to the wall untill you put anything on the shelf. this results in the paint or wall paper coming away from the plaster. no mre nails sticks to paint very well but the paint doesn't stick to the wall so well.

[SethB6025]

Probably just different lots of plastic. I have seen ABS that is grey-white, blue-white, and pink-white. I don't know the chemical reason for this, but it won't affect the durability. The same thing happens with HIPS. If its HIPS it should smell less acrid than ABS, a little more sweet. I haven't seen the PVC suit yet, so I can't comment on it's appearence, but PVC stinks when you cut it & makes a powdery mess.

[TD-4935]

maybe my other kits are HIPS as they melted when dremeled and gave off a not so nasty whiff. now i'm doubly confused

[TD-4510]

I would assemble, cut, sand, final sand with 600 grit, primer, wet sand with 600 then paint. Then if your feeling lucky sand again with a high grit sandpaper and buff out to a nice luster with polish.

if your using the rustoleum stuff, make sure that the surface is finish quality and smoooooooth or else you may have problems with it. Like I did.

If she's going sandy then dont worry too much about it.

[TD 8733]

AP ask me to post this information.

It is .80 ABS and absolutely not PVC. ABS plastic varies from supplier to

supplier and each react slightly differently when forming.

For the very first run we had a different plastic supplier which

unfortunately went bankrupt, so we had to get our ABS from someone else

which has a different hue. The plastic color varies from companies, from

greyish, beige, blue, pink ect... all depend in the mixture, actually color

varies from batch to batch from same company, we order same exact plastic#

from same company and the plastic color tint is diifferent, so we realized

we can't mix match parts made from different batches, we make sure the whole

armor and helmet is produced from same exact batch of plastic. When we order

we need to buy a minimum quantity, .80 is a special order not a standard

gauge, they won't extrude a sample for the small amount of sheets we order,

it's basically take it or leave it, they won't custom hue colors unless you

place a order for thousands of sheets, we just order and ask

for white gloss ABS, there's no particular hues to choose from we don't have

that option.

[TD-4935]

[bearden6521]

Whew, mine AP is ABS...it's turns to powder when sanded! Thanks for the info Paul.

I don't know for sure about styrene,but HIPS melts when you trim it with a sanding wheel and I've been told ABS turns to powder so maybe you can tell what it is that way?-Paul.

[TD-4510]

Did AP mention when he would be able to make me another helmet?

[freakengine]

Any progress on the PVC AP kits? Have any of these been produced yet?

[oo-tee-dee!]

I was told there wasn't enough interest so he wasn't producing them....

[oo-tee-dee!]

Another question - have been advised not to spray armour for fear of the paint chipping or cracking. But if I stick out a mile next to the other creamy white TKs then I won't have a choice.

Any other TKs out there sprayed their armour, if so was it OK or are you having nightmares with the finish and chipping?

[tk-d]

Hi thanks but it is kinda like oo-tee-dee says .Being new to this you kinda wanna fit in and not get it wrong through fear of judgement, And having a kit a different shade to every one else would do that.

If any one has a TE2 kit in the UK what colour do you paint it.

Finally anyone who has a AP kit from the first run would you swap it for one of the new ones and if no why

[The Dirty Trooper]

Sorry mate I'm 100% SDS