Ph1l2007 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 You better believe I'm intersted in this. I really think the Wein Stolla pouches should be done. There are a lot of canvas replicas out there. I would certainly buy them if you made them. Use the best leather possible considering the price of course Thanks for considering this guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 9, 2008 Author Share Posted December 9, 2008 Okay. Hang loose guys. I'm working on a new drawing. I think this will be it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Okay. I talked to a Art today who knows much more about the pouches and such than I. He showed me some great screen caps that show that the shoulder pouches are leather (aside from the move along guy) and even some differences in the construction of the pouches. We've determined the overall size and that the leather should be a tad on the thin side. There are definate clues that show the pouches caved in on the bottoms which would be very difficult if the leather were as thick as the normal leather pouches we see around. The flaps are not completely rounded but rather come to a rounded point. We missed on our button hole placement on this prototype and will correct it on the next prototype. this leather is 3 to 4 oz. but we will be using something in the 4 to 5 oz. range on the final pouches. The construction on the bottom has changed to reflect the new information from Art. I appreciate the help and input that everyone has given. Let me know what you think so far. Another question is this...Would you like for us to sew in accomodations for mounting or make this more as the pouches were originally made? One problem with making them military accurate is that there is good evidence pointing to the possibility that these pouches may have been made by the production company. This would explain why this particular make of pouch has never been found as wells as how poorly constructed these pouches appear by comparison to the real deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK6237 Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 ...Gah? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pappy Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 the prototype is great ,the leather looks similar with the real ones. though there are several more need to be fixed. the height is more like the other wien stolla type than the one you've tried to create above,i say add more height the flaps still missing its 'characteristic',its not just a straight shaped flap,but had a unique contour on them. but agreed with just a rounded point,but make it more closer to the button. i dont know 'bout you guys but i like if the mounting and all is the same like the real deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FIVE Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 These are looking fantabulous man! And the fact they come with that gun too... wow! haha Personally I would love for the back of them to have something that will allow easy attachment / wearing. I think movie-accurate from the front, but why make it hard to use? I'm also thinking of on cutting a hole in the back of mine to put a speaker in them so I can play skutch's "sandtrooper loop" from it. Then I'm going to hide my "voice" speaker in my belt pouch. Of course this isn't something I expect you to work into the design, and I may change my mind about where to put the speakers, but it is something I'm planning right now so I thought I'd share. They're looking grand though... keep us updated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD1009 Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Looks like another great project. Count me in for pouches. Is that MG-15 mold in progress a tease? I've been waiting for that!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Actually, these pouches are the same height as the Stolla Wien pouches. The dimensions are the same. The flaps have been altered to look like the movie pouches which no one has identified. They are from a thinner leather to allow the wrinkles and such that are inherent in the movie pouches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Oh yeah. Didn't mean to post the picture of the MG-15. That's Slavefive's project. I think he started an interest thread... that think is really cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Andrews Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Whewhoo! I am finally back on! Been at least a year since I have been out here! It has been a lot of fun working with John on this project as he has been super patient with me saying "no, more like this" about 100 times and we still aren't done yet! Since I own "Look Sir Droids" and a lot of people use it for pouch ref, I want to make a couple of comments about the Stolla Wein pouches vs what we see on screen. The Stolla Wein pouches are some of the best quality pouches I have ever seen in all my time researching the sandtrooper pouches. I didn't discover them and honestly don't know who did. When I first jumped on the sandy bandwagon in about 2002, they were presented to me, and at the time, with the ref we had, they looked the closest of anything I had seen.... as most people were using those weird single pouch things on their shoulder at the time. As we got better ref it became obvious the Stolla Wein was not the exact pouch seen on screen, but it was still the closest match I had seen and so I still (even to this day) promote it as the pouch to get on Look Sir Droids. Much like the motorocross chest protector/pauldron, it has always bugged me that I have never been able to find an exact match for the pouches, but what do you do? I have seen a LOT of replicas made but nothing that ever really came any closer than what we already have. Fast forward to today and the project John is working on. I really think, after all these years, we will finally have it, the closest thing we will ever get to an original sandtrooper pouch. After John pushed me to revisit the pouch several issues that we had known in the past came to the forefront as well as several new finds. 1. The pouches on the sandtroopers appear to be of a lower quality/thinner leather than the build-like-a-tank Stolla Wein pouches. They don't appear to be like the crappy Norwegian pouches but they def aren't up to par with the Stolla Weins. The tolerances don't appear to be as tight and the overall build quality simply appears to be lower. 2. The pouches on the sandtroopers don't really appear to be real MP-40 pouches, but most likely are remakes. Upon closer inspection, we found a number of details I haven't seen on any original or replica pouches, such as the side panels going all the way to the top of the pouch, making it difficult, if not impossible to actually pull an MP-40 magazine out of the pouch. 3. The pouches have several key difference from the Stolla Wein pouches in regard to build. The top flaps are MUCH shorter than the Stolla Wein, making the overall pouch look longer. The end of the flaps have a blunted "arrowhead" shape while the Stolla Wein pouches have a complex curved shape that comes down to a more defined point. The pouches are individual units and are not connected at the bottom, unlike the Stolla Wein pouches which have a single bottom plate that spans all 3 pouches. Finally, the Stolla Wein pouches are very angular, very precise... the pouches on the sandtroopers simply aren't. They are a little more bubbly, rounded, and don't quite have that same German precision look to them. John is still refining the design and I am SUPER excited about this because John isn't idealizing these (been done to death already) or trying to add anything to them. You are getting straight up, what you see in the movie. If you are looking for the ultimate good looking pouch, I still stand behind Stolla Wein (if you can find them). If you are looking for the closest thing you are ever going to get to what is seen on screen... I believe these are the pouches to get! Looking forward to the next prototype very much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Andrews Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Oh... and don't want to start a riot, but the original canvas pouch seen in the movie isn't black... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Yeah. I've altered the pattern again per my conversation with Art. Lee will have another go at it tonight. We've sent the driver out to pick up some more leather that looks to be closer to what is seen on camera. I'll post some more pictures tonight once we've got another prototype done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 In the move along seen, one set of canvas pouches appears to be brownish to me. Can't really tell very well. I don't have HD Star Wars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Andrews Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 In the move along seen, one set of canvas pouches appears to be brownish to me. Can't really tell very well. I don't have HD Star Wars. I am not really good with colors, but my assumption is that the canvas pouch is the standard brownish green seen on the old pouches. You can really see it when Davin stands up to say "Look Sir, Droids!" The color (whatever) it is, really stands out against the black leather straps.... but we haven't gotten to that pouch, yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Just to recap, since we've taken this thread further without anyone else commenting, check out BraksBuddy's post above for a description of how we've come to this point. Art has been nice enough to help me out with this project. I started this thread not knowing anything about the pouches. After all you guys pointed me in the right direction, I can safely say that I think we are REALLY close to having this thing wrapped up. Thanks for the patience. Thanks again, Art. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pappy Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 i love this thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolf Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 First of all. Nice to see you back in there Art. You are truly one of the big sharks, in the big TD sea. Love the new ANH replica pouch, you have put together. I think the one we see in ANH. Might either bee: 1. A LFL art dept made pouch, and they used the wien stolla as ref. Or. 2. Its the wien stolla, but they just cut them round in the end higher up (under the metal dot closed). If you cut the wien stolla, a few mm. So it turn round, it will look like the ones seen in ANH. But i must say, i don´t think i will cut mine. Once again here you can see my collection: 1 and 2 the ww2 wien stolla. # 3 a expensive replica Dak MP40 ww2 german africa krops canvas pouch. #4 and 5 the ww2 spanish pouch, also seen in ANH. # 6 the small ww2 spanish pouches (seen at the land speeder patrol, dok 94 and alley check patrol) If you look at the wien stolla pouches. You can see the flap are round. Maybe LFL, just cut the wien stolla pouches round. Maybe, they made them... Here you go: As we know most of the weapons where modify by LFL, so where the wien stollas. Or used as ref, made from the ground. Any way, once again. Very nice work Art, and sci-fire crew. Cheers . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Andrews Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 Thanks for the compliments! I don't know about being a "big shark" but I love to give back when I have the opportunity. I am just honored that John would allow me to participate in this project. I see what you are saying about the modification of the Stolla Wein pouches, but the problem is that there are quite a few differences between the Stolla Weins and the ones seen on screen, and I don't think a Stolla Wein, without major modification, could be changed into what we saw on screen. As you mentioned in scenario #2, and as John has previously hypothesized, the more I look at the pouches we see, the more I believe they must have had one or two real pouches to use as guides, and the rest were manufactured by the Art department. I could post some pics if it would be helpful to show the major differences between the Stolla Weins and the ones seen on screen. Personally, I wish they had used the Stolla Wein because they are a much better looking pouch, but we are going for accuracy here, not having a beauty contest! BTW, very nice looking collection! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyone Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 I'm a big fan of your work John, can't wait to see how these turn out. If there is a list, please add me to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD1009 Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 We are incredibly fortunate we have you and your skill Art. I'm obsessed with the details but so often it seems I just see what I'm expecting. It takes a unique talent to be able to look at these images we all have studied and find those specific details that bring us closer to a better replica and enlightenment on the production Sandtroopers. Looking at these images again with your new (to me) observations I see what you are seeing. Fantastic work. Thanks! This and the recent Stormtrooper revelations have made this a great week for fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FIVE Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 This and the recent Stormtrooper revelations have made this a great week for fans.What recent stormtrooper revelations??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD1009 Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 What recent stormtrooper revelations??? Sorry for the off-topic tangent. I was following the thread on the RPF where Brian Muir (who sculpted the original stormtrooper armor among other things) posted his recollections and screen shots of armor test footage from 1976. This led to more researching and discussion of the armor and helmet that is all incredibly interesting. The thread is in the middle of a many page long thread titled "AA case begins" Actually reading the case decision by the judge in the AA court case is a fascinating Star Wars read as well. Here's a link to the RPF thread. Depending on your preferences the new info starts on about page 80 I think. For me it's page 20. There's also a smaller thread here with the screen caps, in general discussion I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK6237 Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 Here's a link to the RPF thread. Depending on your preferences the new info starts on about page 80 I think. For me it's page 20.Brian pops up on page 84 (as "brianian"), and starts his lecture in the last post on page 87. Great read, thanks for the tip! To get back on topic again: I´m amazed at the level of detail you guys are able to pick up from the screen shots! Indeed the flaps on the pouches do look more rounded than on the Stollas. It seems kinda strange to me that the LFL prop department would bother with trimming the ends of the flaps; Perhaps a vintage Stolla was already a rare find back then...Seems more sensible to me that they would choose to make them themselves. Either that, or the pouches are of a make not yet identified. Either way, I can´t wait to see the end result! I´d definitely be in for one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK412 Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 Cool! Sign me up. So John - No Postmorton1 here? TK8034? I guess TK would be appropiate. your everywhere man! Arturo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK8034 Posted December 11, 2008 Author Share Posted December 11, 2008 Actually, watching the way productions work, we make stuff that you can buy off the shelf all the time. The reason is that they need to shoot it tomorrow. The shooting schedule willl not generally change because you can't buy something off the shelf. It's too expensive per hour to hold up the camera with waiting. In this industry, we will work all night if we need to just to make something that you could've bought on Amazon. It happens all the time. I wish I could explain how crazy this industry is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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